>>>>In democratic Israel 60 percent was pro and 40 percent against. I really don't understand why these israeli's oppose:
>>>>1 It has been decided democratically.
>>>
>>>I don't know where did you read these numbers and why do you think it was decided democratically. If was decided by the Israel government, but it was against the will of about half ot its people.
>>
>>Well, that's called parliamental democracy. Besides, as far as I know the majority of the people agree with the parliament.
>>
>>>>2 They know from the very beginning that Gaza isn't theirs.
>>>>
>>>
>>>Who said that? And who defines which land belongs to whom?
>>
>>It was occupied in the six-day war. Simple.
>>
>>>>Why do you have deep respect for people who regard themselves as chosen by God? I think it's quite arrogant to think you're the chosen people.
>>>
>>>It's written in Torah. If you believe in G-d and in Torah, you would follow every word written in it. If you don't believe in it, then you have your own view.
>>
>>Could it be this arrogant view and their way of behaving and dressing that has fed anti-semitism?!
>>
>>>I just gave my feelings and ideas. I don't expect everyone to share them.
>>>
>>>So, we can agree to disagree on this matter. I'm not going to change because of what you're saying and I don't ask you to change too.
>>>
>>>BTW, can you look into this from your grand-father's perspective? What would you think if you were in his skin?
>>
>>The Valença family has never been orthodox. Among the Dutch jews orthodoxy has never flourished. Dutch jews (askernazie or portuguese) could hardly be distinguished from other people. In Antwerp there is a really orthodox community. They are like one black sheep amongst white sheep. Easy to spot for anti-semists.
>
>Well, you said more than enough to show your views. I also stated mine quite clearly. I don't have to be put in a position of defending anything I feel right. EOT from my part.

One thing I have always admired in jewish culture: The preparedness to discuss, no matter the heat of the debate. In our family (what was left of it) we have always had many heated discussions. I'm not asking you to continue this thread. But I am interested in knowing whether heated discussions are also found in your family.