so make it another top-level form if you want them to be related have the froms store object references of each other you can then pass whatever event or data between them Arnon >I've tried that. The problem then is that the 'sub' form is restricted to displaying within the top level form, I want it to have free reign across the desktop. I have the main VFP screen 'shoved' off the page to get rid of it. I had to resort to using page frames. I just think there should be some way of giving each form free access on the desktop (this can be done in C).