>>>>>>>Like all seismic events, this is both shocking and unsurprising. Thoughts?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Since the majority of the Palestinians have given their vote to Hamas, it is now acceptible to state that the Palestinians are terrorists and evil people.
>>>>>
>>>>>I will take this as ironic and not discourse at this point.
>>>>
>>>>Oh please, do not take this as ironic! At best it is cynical, but I'm also quite serious and thoughtful here. Thoughts is what you asked for, didn't you? Remember how Hitler came to power and how we called 'the Germans' since then? Generalization is everywhere and, although it does no justice to certain individuals, it is not that bad a principle as many declare. Sometimes it is better to hold all people of a 'nation' accountable. Suppose that the majority of the Dutch would vote for a Hitler-like person, and I was an opponent. And you would then call the Dutch bad people. I would fully understand that and feel ashamed for being Dutch.
>>>
>>>The Hitler analogy may be apt. A significant (30-40%) minority is so fed up it votes for extremism. This invariably works out badly, but the pulse of the public has its say.
>>>
>>>What I am about to say will probably alienate me permanently from some here, thinking of Tamar in particular. (Tamar, I ask your forgiveness in advance -- you are one of my faves). I think Israel is a horrible ally. They have brought the U.S. nothing but trouble. 9/11 would not have happened if not for our persistent bias for Israel in the endless resentment between Jews and Muslims. We shouldn't be sticking our necks in. Leave them to their endless resentments. To those who are committed enough to care so much about it, move there and duke it out. Don't bring foreign fights to our shores.
>>
>>So, now you suggest that the attack on the Twin Towers is afterall the responsibility, the guilt, of the Jews and even the Americans themselves! And you also hold a plea for non-interventionism and isolationism? I think many bad people in the world would celebrate that, terroristic movements foremost. But the progress of the world, think of trade and internet and the UT, would also come to an end. And in the mean time there would be a dramatic increase of injustice and cruelty on almost every continent, in almost every not-so-democratic country. Not just for some, but for the masses, because dictators would come to power and stay there, for sure.
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>>That reminds me of a saying I've read today in my newspaper. It is written by a columnist who has always been a non-interventionist, but now has turned into an interventionist:
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>>Having clean hands doesn't necessarilly mean you have a clean conscience.
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>
>My country has neither clean hands nor a clean conscience. This is not the spirit of the American people (at least I hope not) but it is the image we are projecting to the world. It's like we're upraising a giant finger and saying we don't care whether you like it or not.
>
>I agree with something Rahm Emanuel said the other day in light of the Alito shoo-in. (Former Clinton advisor, now a Congressman from Illinois). If you don't like it, win more elections. It's time to take this country back from the idiots.

I understand you long back to the days of Clinton? I also liked Clinton more than Bush, and I'd also be a democrat in your country. But remember that it took Clinton three years before he decided to send troops to Kosovo. In those three years 200,000 men got killed there. That's what the columnist was refering to when he was talking about clean hands.