>>Mining already existing data for the purpose of law enforcement is acceptable. There are far too many cases of some of the worse criminals immaginable going free because someone didn't look in the right place. However, limits have always been in place.
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>>The current administration has taken 9/11 and ran with it as an excuse for knocking down all kinds of walls for liberties. I was thinking today how it seems to me that it's been easy for the military to find many who are willing to commit torture. It makes me wonder how far the govt can go before others will rise to put the brakes on.
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>I believe the Echelon project started under Clinton and the government has been spying on subversives forever. As for what's going on under the current administration, if the wiretaps are as I understand them ( international calls) I don't have a problem with them monitoring them. I would have a problem if they didn't. Had they been doing so pre 9/11 we might still have those two buildings and several thousand people. As for the port thing, I can't go with Bush on that one.

I think "Echelon" started way way before Clinton.
It's pretty clear that Echelon lets the U.S. hear/see virtually anything it wants to in/from OTHER COUNTRIES. Echelon is (well, was) not for domestic purposes at all. At least that's what I've always heard when it was mentioned, including the TV show that started this whole discussion.

cheers