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Ex-General hits the nail on the head
Message
From
12/05/2006 12:13:43
 
 
To
11/05/2006 19:46:56
General information
Forum:
Politics
Category:
Other
Miscellaneous
Thread ID:
01119289
Message ID:
01121381
Views:
14
>Hi Jake,
>
>It got too long for me too, but I want to comment on 2 things:

I snipped the end to shorten it up.

>
>You said:
>I also believe that freedom is a cause worth pursuing for the world. Through diplomacy, revolution and war if necessary. This world will be much better off once all its people are free.
>
>Diplomacy and revolution are fine. But war absolutely is not when the (alleged) sole purpose of that war is to "bring democracy to the (warred-on) people". Killing people and destroying their infrastructure/possessions simply is not a reasonable or sensible cost/benefits equation. Period. No ifs, and, or buts.

I must disagree. With the weapons technology that exists today, revolution from the inside is becomming more and more difficult. The people of oppressed countries simply don't stand a chance against despotic regimes in control of the military. The only way they have a chance is with help from the outside. Just to be clear...I am not suggesting that America move from country to country, war after war to "bring" democracy. I am saying that war, under certain circumstances, is an acceptable way to spread freedom. In the case of Iraq I believe the decision was correct. In Iran I am starting to think the decision is correct, but I'm not quite there yet.

>
>You said:
>The UN made the resolutions which were violated. They then refused to enforce them. The US got 60+ countries to agree. The resolution wasn't going to pass specifically because of certain countries..
>
>The UN has many MORE resolutions that have been ignored by Israel but the U.S. has not felt any need to war with Isreal.

I guess this is more proof that the UN is helpless to enforce its resolutions. Israel is a US ally. We do not attack our allies.

>The U.S. didn't get 60+ countries to "agree" (with a war on Iraq) though it did BUY silence or token 'approval' from amny.

Oh come on. Diplomacy is always about "what can you do for me". Just like politics. Bribary and back-room deals are the tools of the trade.

>Compare that to the Afghanistan war which had the whole world in AGREEMENT with no need to buy anyone.

If you don't think there were deals struck then you are blind. Pakistan?

>The purpose of a U.N. is to get resolutions through BY AGREEMENT. The purpose of a U.N. is not to go off in a snit and do what you want anyway when you don't get that agreement. A country that can only respect the U.N. when it suits them is no different than Iraq was in that regard!

That may have been the dream of the UN, unfortunatly it, like the League of Nations, has become a corrupt debating club where little is accomplished and hyupocracy runs rampant. I was hopeful that the latest scandals would force the organization to reform, but it looks like they're sweeping everything under the rug and continuing as usual. The UN is going to collapse if it continues down this path.

>Finally, it is a red-herring/ruse/distraction that the U.N. "is not going to control the security of the U.S. or any other country".

This is a true statement. It should also be true for all other countries.

>I feel for my U.S. neighbours. They are being pushed into paranoia regarding security - the politician's great weapon of mass distraction needed because they are doing positively nothing FOR "the people".

Didn't we already go over the list of distractions?
Global warming
SARS
Bird Flu
West Nile
Child predators on every street

Now that its sweeps I've heard a couple more:
Killer mold in your house
Identity theft

>You have given up rights in favour of security.

We agree, but I think the die is cast with the advancements of technology.

>You are being spied upn by your own government.

Its 2006. Everyone is being spied upon.
Cameras everywhere
Every time you use a credit card
If you have GPS in your car
Fastpay through toll booths
Grocery store member cards

Remember carnivore? http://computer.howstuffworks.com/carnivore1.htm

>You are turning the "U.S. into fortress US and just as much locking yourselves out of the world as much as you are locking the world out.
>
>Finally, a comment regarding your last to me saying 'the economy is booming'. It is, on paper. All the stats show unprecedented "growth" and "productivity".
>But... what if the stats are (unwittingly?) biased? What if the growth part really reflects the higher profits being made by corporations that off-shore their work? What if the "productivity" part (which means more work being done per person) really reflects that corporations have far fewer workers yet higher profits (from off-shoring) making it look like their remaining workers are doing more owrk?? Then there's the all-time low "unemployment rate". What if, in that case, the number of people who no longer qualify for benefits has passed the mid-point so that it really can only go even lower??? In other words, there may well be far more people actually unemployed than ever before, but because they've fallen off the roles the don't count. With food bank usage rsing dramatically and bankruptcies continuing at high rates that seems more plausible to me.

Jim,

You cannot honestly believe that this economy is not booming. If so then you will never see a good economy. How about I take a different approach.

In the last 2 years the following have happened to people I know.
7 have sold their old homes at a huge profit and moved into better homes with 15 year mortages and low rates.
4 have left corporate america to start their own businesses
- architect, farmer, printer and lawyer
2 have begun bottling their own wine and are building a winery
2 have become professional poker players : not sure this is good ;)
6 work/own an alarm installation business that is seeing its best days (new home sales make for other business)
1 has a start-up that has gone national and is looking to sell or go public in the next 3 years (Wall Street capital is good)
1 has a home building company is bigger than ever (been in business for over 10 years, and last year was their biggest)

This is an incomplete list but I think you get the idea.
In addition I know no one who has lost their job, but I do know a number who have left to pursue a better opportunity. Every month I see a new jobs report that is up, housing starts are up, stock market is up. The online job offers are getting better and better because companies are expanding, but can't get enough qualified people to fill the positions. Every where I look I see positive growth. I stand by my statement : If you're not benefiting, you're not trying.

Honestly, if you can't improve your condition in an economy this strong then maybe you don't have the ambition to be sucessful.

>>SNIP
Wine is sunlight, held together by water - Galileo Galilei
Un jour sans vin est comme un jour sans soleil - Louis Pasteur
Water separates the people of the world; wine unites them - anonymous
Wine is the most civilized thing in the world - Ernest Hemingway
Wine makes daily living easier, less hurried, with fewer tensions and more tolerance - Benjamin Franklin
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