>Ok, I'll accept that you think it can happen. We disagree on that, but hey, that's what makes the world go round. However, what about the 2nd part of the issue. Even if they manage to find a way to stop people at the border, do you really (honestly now) believe that they can make the 12 million or so who are already in the country simply disappear back to Mexico or wherever? If you accept that they cannot, then what? If you think they can do that too, then I guess we are at an impasse, but I think you'll end up being angry about the status quo until you're a very old man.

<bg> I'm already a very old man!

Ok, we won't get them all out, but I think we can get a lot of them out. And mostly close the borders. Rather than a sledgehammer, mabye there is a more surgical way of removing those that don't meet some criteria. No, I don't know what that criteria should be exactly, but maybe if they have kids, etc. there is something that can be done. If they have been convicted of any crime, or do not have familiy, or any other number of things, then they are out. Period. Once they are found, of course. And companies that employ them should be severely penalized. Enough to discourage them from acting illegally themselves. That's probably the closest I'm going to come towards your side of things.