>Your whole argument is premised on the assumption that if there were no guns, there would be no murders,

I dont believe Walter or anyone is arguing or assuming that.

>or even less murders. Well here's a historical factoid for you: People have been killing each other since Cain & Able. It has always been, and always will be. Guns are just the tool of the trade that criminals today choose to use. If you take them all aways, they'll just pick up a baseball bat or knife.

You dont believe that there would be less murders?