Ok I'm back..... San Francisco is beautiful even on a business trip.

You sort of disappoint me.
I thought you were going to come back with lots of scientific proof to illustrate that unborn child is not human.


>>Of course I respect your view. As usual you bring up great points.
>>I think you've convinced yourself that the unborn child is not human. I believe it is... what else can it be?
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>Nothing yet. Tissue. Human to be, maybe.
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>>Remember, Nazi Germany convinced themselves that the Jewish people were sub-humans.... I hope this doesn't offend anyone.
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>And so did many groups convince themselves at some point that any non-members are sub-human (applies to many a monotheistic religion, ancient Romans, conquistadors...). It's so easy to found a club, claim exclusivity and then assign any set of properties to the non-members.
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>However, I simply think that humans-to-be are not humans yet. Simple as that.
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>>So when a expectant mother says "I'm carrying a child." do say to her "No. You're carrying an sub-human thing."? :)
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>You say "good for you". Do you go around and fix everyone's logical errors? If she feels it's a child - well, she's expectant, and she's expecting to see it soon, as it will be when it is born, not as it is at the moment. She's looking into the future - that's how I understand the word "expect".

This is where I don't understand how you come to the conclusion that the unborn child isn't human.

So, I guess you disagree with some states charging the murder of a pregnant woman with double homicide as in the Scott Peterson case.

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>>I said this before in other thread, I can live with early term abortion. It's late term abortion that gives me grief.
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>Same here - late term is just dangerous and does bring up ethical questions. But the point of contention is the campaign to stretch this to any abortion in general, and to leave women without a choice. And that was the main question: should people be free to choose whether and when to have children, or not? Sounds like a no-brainer to me, but somehow it became an issue.

Just dehumanize them and you won't have any reason to feel bad, they're just clump of tissues.