Perhaps I did insult some people. That would be the people that think like Andy - that it's the communities fault that VFP was EOLed.

The logic is simple:

M$ buys VFP
M$ ignores VFP marketing (marketing works, M$ knows lack of marketing also works)
This sends the "we don't care about this product message"
Many people decide they'd better move to other products
When enough people leave and sales drop, M$ says "oh, no one's buying it, let's kill it"
Andy blames the community for this chain of events

Sorry, you may see it like Andy does, but I - and others - see where the root of the problem stems from and that's M$. I was disappointed that people left and would not stick it out and keep buying and using the new versions, but that's a far cry from blaming them (and the ones who did stick it out). After all, it's hard to fight the 8 billion pound gorilla. I'm not going to blame people for leaving, but I did encourage people to stay and support the product. However, they made a business decision. Andy claims to understand business decisions, but he criticizes the community for a real business decision ("the writing on the wall") and defends M$ for a false and dishonest business decision.

Are you offended? You shouldn't be. What you should do is think this through more carefully and place the blame where it really lies instead of on your fellow developers. Hopefully you can do that.


>Aren't you sort of shooting the messenger here? Andy was able to "read the signs", and told us about his conclusion. OK, so please put me in the same category, I was also able to "read the signs", and I did espress myself openly a few times. Read what you REALLY say here, and you will see that YOU are also insulting a lot of people by your words! So I will take your approach, and always think badly about you from now on, no matter what else you do of good things to the community.
>
>>Hey, I swore off cannibalism for New Years and so far - knock on wood - I haven't slipped.
>>
>>I think the statement you refer to was the statement I am referring to. The stupidity of that statement is that M$ ignored the product from an advertising support standpoint and that sends a big, giant message. M$ is an excellent marketing company. They know its power and they know what lack of it does, also. They turned their back on it - except that they did let the team serve up improvements - knowing the message that would send. Many people got the message and decided to move to other pastures. Then M$ turns back around, says "hey, where did everyone go?" and act like they're surprised. Then Andy chimes in with his very thick assessment of the situation, ignoring the very powerful message sent by M$ via their lack of marketing, and blaming the community by saying we didn't buy enough. Well, duh, can you blame people? The answer for him seems to be "yes" and I - and others - find that INCREDIBLY insulting.
>>
>>Now, has he been generous in the past? Sure. But where was the generosity (or, perhaps more accurately, his brain) when he made the "it's the community's fault" statement? Hmmm? Where? Nowhere is the answer. It was blame the victim. So he loves the community so much that he blames it for being defecated on by M$? Yeah, that's real love!
>>
>>Personally, I bought every version of VFP, either directly or via MSDN Universal and I encouraged other people to do that, also. Jim Eddins of FoxToolBox.com recently told me "According to Ken Levy VFP 8 far exceeded VFP 7 in sales and VFP 9 outsold both 7 and 8 combined." So the lack of sales issue may be another smoke screen.
>>
>>I'm not sure where your "enemy of the VFP community" quote came from (or maybe you did not mean it as a quote but rather a "this is the way he is being portrayed" statement), but I didn't say that. I haven't gone that far with my feelings. As for his past contributions, I take nothing away from him. However, I found that one statement so insulting (and, as I said, pretty stupid), that I would not want to attend any of his sessions were I going to SW Fox. I believe I posted a reply to his blog entry and others have expressed their opinions, but I think he's too full of himself to rethink his statements and apologize.
>>
>>Bottom line is this: I have worked hard for VFP and I have supported it. I know many others who have. For him to point fingers - even at the people who left when they felt M$ was delivering a powerful message - is da-mn-ed insulting and I resent it. It's a blame game he was playing for his own benefit, but he hasn't the guts or intelligence to point his finger at the real culprit. I thank him for all the past efforts, but until I hear an apology, I'd personally not like to hear his name or see his face again.
>>
>>Ok, now you know my real feelings . . .
>>
>>
>>>I must have missed the blog entry to which you refer. I know he said part of the problem VFP was not economically viable for MS was that VFP developers did not actually buy new versions in sufficient numbers. But even if he said something you don't agree with, how does that negate sharing knowledge and time with Fox developers over the years? Obviously you feel very strongly about whatever comment he made, and you are certainly entitled to be offended by it if you like and perhaps you could point me to a specific blog entry that would cause me to feel as you do.
>>>
>>>Personally, I've had enough conversations with Andy over the years to think I have some idea of how he feels about a lot of things and while I don't agree with some of it, I have never seen him to be selfish in sharing what he knows even when there was nothing in it for him. I'd call that generosity of spirit. I am a little surprised to see him cast in the roll of 'enemy of the VFP community' (to which he has contributed a great deal)
>>>
>>>I have seen this 'community' change a great deal from the CIS days and one of the characteristics that seems to have become more prevalent is the tendency to eat its own.
>>>
>>>