>>Things seem a little heated with straw men in every direction, so I'm going to provide another quotation and move on. Here it is:
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>>"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." - Aristotle
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>>Obama seems very good at that- I understand that on at least one occasion he took the Devil's Advocate position and argued against his most capable advisors to ensure that he fully understands the implications before commenting publicly. It also helps advisors to test their own positions rather than becoming ideologues. If there is to be a contrast, perhaps it should be to the sort of intellectually incurious statesman who forms an opinion and doesn't like to be contradicted.
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>One of the things that makes me most hopeful is that Obama does seem to want to hear a wide range of opinion and is open to being convinced. He's not afraid of ideas.
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>Tamar

I really liked his speech where he stated something to the effect of that he doesn't care where an idea comes from if it's a good idea, then it's a good idea period.