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19/03/2009 11:54:34
 
 
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19/03/2009 11:08:59
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Level Extreme
Catégorie:
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Divers
Thread ID:
01388748
Message ID:
01389560
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46
>>>>>I don't see an image that needs refreshing. Maybe the rest of the world needs to adjust their thinking.
>>>>
>>>>Okay, I think you need an explanation. Many Europeans think bad about the US. Although, I must conclude that it also is correlated to the type of president your country has chosen. The image is far better since Obama is your president, and it was also better when Clinton was president. To be clear about this: My personal opinion about the US is far more positive than the average in Europe. But on the other hand, Obama is not a factor for me, as it is for so many other Europeans.
>>>
>>>Saying "many Europeans" do you imply obvious majority?
>>
>>It is indeed a majority, and I do not belong to that majority. Walter does belong to that majority.
>
>No questions about Walter :).
>Frankly, I was more interested to get your first-hand experience, than questioning your or anyone else views.
>The first issue that interests me is about majority composure. As I know, conservative parties still get sizable vote in many European countries. Does the idea about "majority" mean that many people voting conservative/non-socialist line in Europe still strongly prefer Dems to Reps in America?

I think Yes is the answer here. It is indeed true that the anti-US frame of mind is most typical for people in the socialistic/social-democratic wing. Then there is a substantial group of people who endorse free market, liberalism and capitalism. One might expect that these people think totally positive of the US, but they favor the US only in general. Even they think negative, about certain issues. Think of guns, health care, social security, death penalty. They are of opinion that these issues are better dealt with in Europe. In other words, they prefer their own implementation of free market, liberalism and capitalism. And they criticize the US for not making real progress with regard to those issues.

Prefer Dems to Reps? Yes, I think that European Cons are closer to your Dems than what you probably assumed.

There's another aspect that has influence. Quite many European cons and libs do not believe in a God. In their hearth they abhor the religiousness that has found root in the politics of the US nation, nothwithstanding that the US too has a formal separation between religion and politics.

Where do I stand? I'm a left winger and social democrat and VERY atheistic. But I'm also a true criticizer of esp. the left wing in the Netherlands, whom (in my eyes) have betrayed some of the original goals of their predecessors. And one of my main critics is that I think the leftish people are far too cynical about the intentions of the US. Examples: They oppose Guantanamo Bay, I don't. They condemn the Iraq War, I don't. They think Bush lied all the time, I don't. They think it's all for the oil, I don't. They think the US conspires extensively to be in control everywhere, I don't.
Groet,
Peter de Valença

Constructive frustration is the breeding ground of genius.
If there’s no willingness to moderate for the sake of good debate, then I have no willingness to debate at all.
Let's develop superb standards that will end the holy wars.
"There are three types of people: Alphas and Betas", said the beta decisively.
If you find this message rude or offensive or stupid, please take a step away from the keyboard and try to think calmly about an eventual a possible alternative explanation of my message.
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