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Don't Upset The Muslims
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From
24/04/2012 07:28:42
 
 
To
24/04/2012 06:02:02
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Forum:
News
Category:
International
Miscellaneous
Thread ID:
01542140
Message ID:
01542434
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42
You guess wrong about whom I'm referring to. ( good objective pronoun but a preposition is a bad word to end a sentence with ;-)

I did not intend to point Voltaire at Islam ( for which I certainly have as much respect - at least in its Sufi variant - as I do the Christianity I grew up with and out of. )

I agree with you that most of the history of human tragedy can be traced to humans who allowed themselves to believe things that gave them permission - or instructions - to do very bad things.

Eric Hoffer wrote a book in the 50s called "The True Believer". He was talking about the human need - or weakness - to give up personal decision making and moral responsibility to something Greater. The true believer can easily shift from religious zealot to right-wing paramilitary murderer to left wing torturer in the basement of the Lubyanka. What he believes is not important, only that there is Belief.

The right or left or God or no God is not the issue. The surrendering to belief without thinking and acting without feeling personal responsibility is the problem.

( you may be right about the "misquote" - I don't remember the original French - though I do seem to remember he used "ont" which I think would more accurately be "one" in English rather than "you" but since we seldom use impersonal pronouns like they do in French is it most often translated in passive voice. Either way I don't see it changes the meaning. He felt a belief in absurdities was the path to committing atrocities. I think we would both agree )

>>>Walter,
>>
>>I think Voltaire had it right. "Those who can be made to believe absurdities can be made to commit atrocities."
>
>Ain't that right ? :)
>What 'absurdities' (or atrocities) do you have in mind ?
>Or maybe; Who do you have in mind ?
>
>Original quote says;
>'Those who can make YOU believe absurdities can make You commit atrocities'
>( It is not about 'them' (those infamous radical Muslims I guess you refer to) it is about you )
>
>
>which leads us to some interesting questions ;
>
>What were the Wars in the last 100 years (or just 10 if you wish) that DID NOT involve 'making people believing absurdities' in it's making ?
>
>WW1 ?
>WW2 ?
>Afganistan ?
>Iraq ?
>
>British intervention on Malwinas for instance was one rare case of clean, non-pretentious/brainwashing free 'defense' of an old imperial loot {g}, can you come with more 'clean' war examples like this ?
>Most of other wars were incited by subject of your favorite Voltaire's (miss)quote.
>
>Give me at least 3 wars in last 100 years (not necessarily lead by US!) that were not started this way.
>I am really hungry for some new history lessons ;)
>
>1$ Question:
>Did Voltaire merely lamented on poor state of mind in France of his days, or maybe he spoke of something much more
>profane/sinister like maybe - some political/war propaganda of his day ?


Charles Hankey

Though a good deal is too strange to be believed, nothing is too strange to have happened.
- Thomas Hardy

Half the harm that is done in this world is due to people who want to feel important. They don't mean to do harm-- but the harm does not interest them. Or they do not see it, or they justify it because they are absorbed in the endless struggle to think well of themselves.

-- T. S. Eliot
Democracy is two wolves and a sheep voting on what to have for lunch.
Liberty is a well-armed sheep contesting the vote.
- Ben Franklin

Pardon him, Theodotus. He is a barbarian, and thinks that the customs of his tribe and island are the laws of nature.
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