>>>>>> At this stage I don't see much of a path to what you would call a successful presidency.
>>>>>
>>>>>What president since FDR would you call successful?
>>>>
>>>>Clinton, Obama, Regan, Kennedy, etc. all seem to rank pretty high on the lists when you google for such info - and of course Johnson did accomplish quite a bit despite his problems with the Vietnam war. These guys didn't do this by spreading hate and appointing wildly unqualified people to important positions.
>>>>
>>>>www.washingtonpost.com/news/monkey-cage/wp/2015/02/16/new-ranking-of-u-s-presidents-puts-lincoln-1-obama-18-kennedy-judged-most-over-rated/
>>>
>>>I didn't ask what the polls of the moment showed.
>>>If we had followed the polls of the moment, Thomas Dewey would have clobbered Harry Truman and Hillary Clinton would have devastated Donald Trump.
>>>I asked what president since FDR you'd call successful.
>>
>>I don't understand where you're going here or what point you're trying to make. Are you suggesting that there hasn't been a successful presidency in this country since FDR or what? We can look back on all former presidents and make such a determination - and we can evaluate the results of their actions better as more time passes - but to think there has actually been no successful presidency since 1945 is absurd at best.
>
>Here's what you said:
>
>>>>>> At this stage I don't see much of a path to what you would call a successful presidency.
>
>I think that Truman, Ike and JFK were our last successful presidents.
>Since the 1960's our electorate has been a mess and our presidents have reflected the electorate.
>Remember, Victor, GW Bush - a dimwit who started a needless war that cost more lives than Hiroshima and Nagasaki combined- was easily re-elected.
>Trump is the latest in the chain of increasingly deficient people who represent the collective will of the US electorate.
>Obama is a fluke. He was just as unsuccessful and incompetent, but he's not as rotten as the rest.
>Bernie is also a fluke.
>Except for Bernie -a throwback to another era- compare the people who stood up and debated for the nomination of both parties this year with people like Truman, Ike, or JFK.
>Hillary Clinton probably hit some kind of low point on the dem side and Trump plumbed the depths for the repubs.
>You have pointed to a degenerate who molested interns and sold pardons as an example of a good president. In the context of the people who preceded and followed him, you're probably right.
>
>That sounds pessimistic but it can be turned around.
>Bernie came close.
>Obama was elected. He was a stiff, but at least he wasn't a dimwit or a pervert and we can get some who isn't a stiff the next time.
>
>Forget about demonizing Trump.
>Look at our party. That's where the problem is and where the solution is.
>We shall overcome.


hmmmm - well I think we must have a fundamental disagreement on what is considered an 'unsuccessful presidency"- which I admit is somewhat ambiguous. You seem to think that Obama was a failed presidency, but yet he did get us out of the worst economic crisis since the great depression, lowered unemployment, and got 20 million more people heath care coverage, and he got a few terrorist out of the picture. Now I know people like to try to claim all the numbers are rigged but of course that is B.S. that has been debunked repeatedly so I don't want to get into that here.
The problem isn't so much the party - it's the fact that when it comes to government and politics - Americans are stupid. That is how you end up with someone like Trump as a president - bunch of stupid people somehow think it's a good idea to have such a person as a leader. It's rather sad to come to realize just how many ignorant and bigoted people we share our society with. And yes 'we shall overcome' is most likely correct (assuming we survive long enough to overcome) - but you'll notice than many of the things he and congress are screwing up are things that can take a decade or two to fix. I strongly suggest you do some research on something here - and that is that congress is using a fairly recent obscure law called known as the Congressional Review Act.. if the law is used to strike down a rule, the federal agency that issued the rule is barred from enacting similar regulation in the future!!!
In other words - we're screwed and it's a sad time for plants and animals too. I don't think one should abandon demonizing Trump - now is the time to stand up and be heard, talk to your congressman, your local and regional leaders, and protest. If you do these things then those in power are being watched closer (and they know it) and that is a good thing.