>>Ok so once again I want to be clear here. I asked if you think the Russians messed with the election. Not asking if Trump had anything to do with it - I'm just asking if you think the Russians messed with the election or not. It sounds like you're saying no you don't believe it - but I want to be sure that's what you're saying.

I'm saying that nobody seems to be able to show hard evidence of Russian involvement, so I'm not prepared to caterwaul on the topic.

There is some evidence that doesn't help you. E.g. Jill Stein alleged that voting machines were susceptible to hacking, somehow funding a Wisconsin manual recount that increased Trump's lead and firmly rebuffed claims of tampering or interference by anybody let alone dirty Russians.

Stein commented immediately afterward: "This recount was never about changing the outcome; it was about validating the vote and restoring confidence in our voting system to Americans across the country who have doubts." Not sure why it didn't have that effect on you, but for me this equates to Stein blowing up doubts about the result with wild unsubstantiated allegations, and then turning the disproof into a virtue.

Meanwhile the "17 intelligence agencies" that apparently found Russian interference have shrunk to the expected 3 whose own statements months ago confirmed that their allegations are not based on hard evidence, but mostly on familiarity with those dirty Russkies - "this is exactly the sort of thing those Russians would do. Voila."

Based on this "take it from me" argumentation, the Russians were punished by Obama in his lame duck period, with the same 3 agencies surprised when the Russians failed to issue the predicted retaliation.

A cynic might respond that perhaps intelligence agencies don't know the dirty Russkies any better than they knew about WMD in Iraq. A sensible person might ask "where's the beef."