/ pageframes. Pageframes don't have a baseclass of "container" and don't / have a controlcount property or a Controls() array, but pages do, and / pageframes have a pagecount property and a Pages() array, which might be This may be an excessive wish, but the property naming used is quite inconsistent - Commandgroup and OptionGroup have ButtonCount and Buttons() array, Container and Form have ControlCount and Controls(), PageFrame has PageCount and Pages()... so whenever I write some generall stuff, it must have some stuffed Case ... Endcase constructs, just to handle the differences. I wish there was an alias to these, like ElementCount and Elements() array.