>That's one point, but, IMO, the development side of the this is overemphasized. Once you have your base "Save" button, if you wanted to do something like change its font, width, height, whatever, you simply changed the parent and all the children change as well.

I just paste my a save button from a previous project or another form. I still do everything through the command window. Weird, huh?

But usually I only have ony save button and generalized methods that may be routed to by any or any combination of controls. The projects I work are pretty demanding. Maybe these frameworks are meant for developers with less (over?) confidence than I. As it stands right now, VFP puts a lot of layers between me and the machine, I can't see additional insulation of a frame tool making my apps run faster or perform better. I just see an app conforming to the requirements of the framwork.

The question is: Faster Powerful Systems or Faster development time for those who do not yet have the experience to write fast apps. If your app is gonna execute slow regardless of a frame tool, then a fram will not affect the outcome.

We need a challenge: Can a developer, without a frame tool, and expert skills, build a faster, more seamless and powerful interface than a journeyman with a frame tool? I was in a pool hall one night, and saw this guy (using the bar broom) kick the cagatha out of a guy with a perl inlaid, goldtrimmed queue stick. His stick made him look bad, but he got beat by a guy with a broom!