John,

>Doug
>
>>>I disagree I suppose with you on your last point. I think there is a place for self defense.<<
>
>Of course... but how do you defend yourself against somebody whose perception of life is so different from yours that the "freedom" we permit ourselves to travel, live and play, freedom which relies on societal goodwill, is cast as a weakness and used against you?

Well, this leads to that age old question dealing with the notion of how moral people deal with immoral ones. Or how law-abiding people deal with those who have no internal 'compass', so to speak.

I think that those who do wish to obey the law need to deal with those who do not on their terms. One should just be extra careful/scrupulous to protect one's self against internally adopting the lawless attitude

IOW, I think at the end of the day the answer here is in attitude.

We had a movie produced in Hollywood years ago where a young boy was faced with having to shoot his dog as the dog had contracted rabis. It was all about the notion of growing up. Weeping, the young lad put his dog down.

I say that weeping we must literally put these people down.

>
>Of course you have to deliver a reprimand to those who flouted the values we base our society upon and of course payment has to be in a coin the culprits understand.

Well, for those countries that harbored these thugs I'd think they deserve about the same treatment. The Taliban should be severely punished if they fail to "cough up" bin Laden - as though they were bin Laden IMO.

>
>You may think the world takes you for granted but I think you would be surprised. FWIW I was born in a tiny country of just 3 million people, New Zealand, that has already said that it will do whatever it can to support the USA in the unpleasant but unavoidable chore that lies ahead of the free world.
>

I do not think the world takes us for granted. I think some in this world hate us in an irrational manner. I also think some resent our place in the world.

I am comfortable they feel the way they do.