>>If you take out songs that have any religious connotations, and that have "adopted" religious connotations (like "Jingle Bells" -- it was originally a Thanksgiving song, but is now considered a Christmas song), what are we left with?

>There's a difference between studying something as part of an exploration of culture and having that thing be "the way we do things here." I have no problem with teaching kids about the practices of different religious and ethnic groups, as long as it's clearly labeled as such, and as long as lots of groups are covered, not just mainstream Christianity.

But music class isn't necessarily an exploration of culture...there's learning *how* to sing or play an instrument. And that requires singing or playing the music, much of which springs from religious roots. I think the winter holidays get scooped up by the music teachers (especially in elementary school) because the melodies and words are quite well known. You figure schools start in fall, and it takes a few months of once-a-week classes to get some good sounds for a concert, so you're into December. Well, everyone is generally celebrating something in December, which is why the music is chosen. Unfortunately, there isn't a whole lot of choice for "winter music" that isn't about or refers to a religion.

>I had to sing the assigned song because it was part of the course, but I knew I really shouldn't.

Shouldn't? I guess I have very different views, but I've never considered singing songs from someone else's religion to be compromising my own. I know where my values are, and I show my respect for others by singing their songs. Of course, I think that as many religions and cultures should be represented in the curriculum (or concert), but I also don't want music teachers teaching songs they know nothing about simply to make sure there's "one of each flavor" represented.

>As you know, my kids are fairly serious about music. I've had to come to terms with the fact that as choristers, much of the music they perform has religious roots (in fact, much is church music). But, they weren't singing this stuff until high school; if they're going to study music at the college level (which several students from our high school do every year), they need this repertoire; and, perhaps most important, our choirs also perform a wide variety of music from around the world, not just Christian music.

Exactly. All kinds of music needs to be taught. Most of our music and tradition comes from all kinds of religious backgrounds and world cultures. However, if the argument is that we don't allow any religious music in the schools because it makes children of other religions uncomfortable, then we must ensure that NO religious songs are sung. That rules out a LOT of music, not just Christian Christmas carols! And that music is important to American culture -- as you and your children already know.

>>With my Girl Scout troop, I no longer celebrate holidays of ANY kind.
>Sorry to hear that the parents from your troop are so narrow-minded. Learning _about_ other cultures is tremendous.

I *love* learning about other cultures, and finding out all kinds of wonderful customs, music, and food. Unfortunately, many people are missing out. We do have a GS day called "Thinking Day," (Feb. 22) where we think about Girl Scouts and Girl Guides from all over the world. The parents have typically enjoyed and encouraged this, as each troop studies one country, then does a short presentation of what they've learned at an event. As long as we keep it to what games they play, simple children's songs from that country, tasting food, and learning the Girl Scout or Girl Guide Promise and Law from that country, parents usually love this activity. But I'll NEVER explore the December holidays with children who have parents! It's so sad that the kids enjoyed learning about others, but the parents turn a good learning experience into a tremendously stressful time for the leader.

>Nathaniel has a buddy who's Christian, from a very religious (and very musical) family. (We went to his baptism when he was about 10.) For whatever reasons, many of Luke's friends are Jewish, so we'd see him at Bar Mitzvah after Bar Mitzvah during that year-and-a-half when this group spent a couple of Saturdays a month in synagogue. We were always amused to see Luke singing along, including on lots of the Hebrew songs that are part of the service.

Nathaniel sounds lucky to have a friend like Luke. Luke's going to have a wonderful outlook on life, and will be able to really celebrate diversity. I hope my children will be lucky enough to _enjoy_ taking part in the religious lives of friends, especially when the religion is so different than their own.

- della