Hi Dragan,

Been busy...

>>I'm curious..
>>
>>Would you object to separate posters/signs around a school that said:
>>
>>Don't steal
>>Don't Lie
>>Don't murder your classmate
>>Don't take something that's not yours
>
>I told you once already, it's the first one that I'd vastly object to - it's against all laws of fair advertising, and tends to establish a monopoly, which is also banned by another set of laws.

Well, I understand your objections. I rather think that theis doesn't remove the facts, particularly with respect to the notion of the cultural origins of these laws as they have been included in the fabric of our culture today. Stealing is still considered 'wrong' in spite of its origin (culturally) in the 10 Commandments.

>
>>Or do you support signs that say:
>>
>>Steal if it meets your needs
>>Lie to get what you want
>>Murder your classmate if you have to
>>Take what you need but only that
>
>This is called vulgarization in my language. It's below your intellectual level.

Why, that's one of the nicest compliments I've gotten. Thnk you.

However, I disagree. I am not attempting to 'vulgarize' the language. I am, however, pointing out that when we are discussion what could be described as culturally accepted absolutes (regardless of their origin) that the antithesis of these arguments must be examined of we reject them. IOW, if we are all in favor of teaching children to not steal then so be it. It is a fact that this is one of the 10 commandments and that in our society there is a direct 'link' to this teaching and its direct emmination from either Judaism or Christianity. That's not 'forcing' it on anyone. That is a straightforward recognision of the facts in this case.

Now, if you reject the concept to not steal you must replace it with something! What do you replace an absolute with but its antithesis?

>
>>I'm being facetious of course but that's what six (6) of the ten (10) commandments say.
>
>Any particular reason why you didn't mention the other four? This is not a school, and you're not a teacher, so nobody would mind if you mentioned them for the sake of dispute.

Well, that would open up a whole other set of threads. Essentially the first four have to do with mankind's relationship with God whereas the following six deal with man's relationship to his fellow man. It's really pretty straightforward but I thought that would take us off track I suppose.

>
>>You see, from the POV of folks like myself, if you wanted to post an athiet's Code of Ethics alongside the 10 Commandments
>
>If there was such a thing, I think they should not be called Commandments; first line should probably be "don't even try to command others".

Except those of us who they disagree with. <g> "Take out your 10 commandments!" <g>

>
>But then, I'm not an atheist - does that count me out from creation of such a document?

Well I suppose from that aspect of the discussion. You do understand that the English translation of the word 'agnostic'' is pretty close to 'ignoramous' don't you? <g> a-gnosko = no knowledge

>
>>Ergo Athiesm is a religious system.
>
>Agreed. A negation of a thing is just a reflection of the thing it negates. That's why I say I am not an atheist - I don't feel any need to prove the existence or non-existence of any deities. They exist as ideas.

Actually, that is closer to a true definition of athiesm than most who call themselves such but are really agnostics.

>
>>Does that make sense? There's really no way to do this practically - unless the real agenda is to remove Christianity's influence and replace it with some other. This is, I think, what is really going on. It's not really about anti-religious efforts but anti-Christian efforts.
>
>Another belief of yours, and you're entitled to keep it.
>
>>Why? People hate God. *shrug* Kind of sad really since He loves them - even when they hate Him.
>>
>>What's everyone so afraid of? Jesus????
>
>Afraid? Where did you get this from?

From some 30 years of observation. Also, some people actually hate God. Kind of a crazy idea, don't you think? Even for someone who doesn't believe or know if there were a God you'd be prett dumb to hate Him. No sense on getting God mad at you. <g>