Charles - I would have lost my last reply because the experiment worked

I found that I cannot reference a form method in whatever routine I call from on shutdown - or at least I cannot clear events and do a normal application shutdown

But 'on shutdown' will not interrupt Windows if you keep it simple.

I noticed that =disconnect(0) gave an illegal connection handle message on shutdown so there is more to find out - and an Oracle user would still be logged in if an abnormal shutdown is done at least till it times out depending on other Oracle functions.

But the system did restart OK

Thanks for the help

Bob