>>>MS always contends that cross platform capability is no longer an issue because of browsers. In short, they're challenging us to make our application browser based so that it runs anywhere. Java programs runs anywhere but it runs best if it is server-side, and for that matter, application should also be browser based.
>
>Whoops! Can't use the new IE. WinXP and the new IE doesn't support Java. So much for 'cross platform capability'. That leaves WinXX users with StarOffice, Netscape and Opera, or some older, less desirable relics. Linux users have Netscape, Konqueror, Opera, Maya, Lynx, Mozilla, StarOffice, Gallion, and some others whose names escape me now.
>
>>>
>>>>>Here in Bolivia, lots of people might be interested - many people are looking at Linux, for cost reasons.
>>>>
>>>>Actually, in any country. But todate, AFAIK, their is no stable Linux client that I know of.
>
>In your country? Are there no vendors selling modern Linux distros? Does your government restrict the downloading of SuSE 7.3 and other ISOs?
>
>>
>>>Jess;
>>>
>>>Yes, Microsoft would like everyone to have a "Browser Experience". Browsers are not "ready for prime time". Trying to run many types of applications through a browser has a number of limitations. Some types of applications will run fine but there are many issues that should be taken into consideration. Each browser and version will behave differently to issues such as security, printing, and behavior.
>
>True. Browsers are not 'state' applications so 'state' conditions have to be tacked on programatically. We are designing all of our apps around w3c browsers using Java, which accesses data from an Oracle db. OS independent, except that the new IE won't work, but that doesn't matter. We are not going to load XP or the new IE on any of our 300+ workstations.
>
>
>>
>>>Would you mind explaining what a "stable Linux client is"?
>>>
>>>Tom
>>We do use Linux as OS Internet Server only not on client machine. For business applications say LAN environment, I haven't seen pure Linux based apps that sits in the server (LINUX OS) and at the same time in the Workstation (LINUX OS).
>
>I don't understand what you are saying here. An app that plays on a server running Linux and also on a client workstation running Linux? Well, there is StarOffice. You can run it standalone as a client Office suite, or you can install it on a server and run client workstations against it. Several other apps work the same way. While some folks like Corel's Word Perfect Office 2000, I didn't. But, it's another app of the same breed.
>
>
>
>A mixture of Linux/Windows, Unix/Windows, OS2/Windows but majority WindowsNT2000/Windows. The trend has been that way since 1990. The reason why full blown Linux based apps is not taking off significantly IMHO is that you need to do a lot tweaks (Linux Expertise) to make it running smoothly and ofcourse more importantly, stable.
>
>No. The real reason is because Windows comes preinstalled on new PCs, including Microsoft Works, IE, MediaPlayer, etc..., and the OEM agreements prevent vendors from installing other OSs in dual boot mode, to say nothing of ICON layouts. If stability were a reason to keep folks away from an OS then Microsoft would have lost the PC OS crown to Linux five years ago, after Win95 came out.
>
>I dare say that if Microsoft didn't have a illegal monopoly in being preinstalled on new PCs, and folks had to install it themselves, you would find that installing WinXX can be just as difficult, if not more so, than Linux. For either OS, installation ease and tweeking necessities vary more based on the hardware combinations one is trying to install on than anything else.
>
>It's been a while since you visited the Linux desktop, hasn't it? All I am running, as I type this, are Linux binaries (ELF) or Java jars. I run QuickTime 5.0 from WINE. Nothing else.
>
>Tweeks? What are they? Is that something you do with RegEdit.EXE?
>What is really holding people back is lethargy, along with the unfounded fear that they will have to 'learn something new'. That was the BIG concern a year ago when we installed SuSE 6.4 on a production machine. A year later, up 24/7 and without a single crash, the women who runs it says it is easier to use than Windows. Not bad, considering SuSE 6.4 runs the old KDE 1.x In truth, there is no essential or show stopping difference between mousing around on a Windows box and doing the same on a Linux box. Click is click.
>
>Three weeks ago I put the SuSE 7.3 Pro Install CD in my CDROM and answered some questions about screen resolution and type of installation. Forty five minutes later I had a perfect install. PlexStor CD-R, BJC-620 connected via a Zip250, SBLive!, etc., detected and installed automatically. SuSE has a graphical admin program called YaST2. (Yet another System Tool). It is easier to use than the admin tools which comes on my W2K at work.
>
>"Make" Linux Stable? You have got to be kidding. You don't do anything to 'make Linux stable'. It defines stability. Since Linux 2.4 the kernel (at least the SuSE config) is totally modular. You don't even have to compile it any more, but you can if you want. You can add or remove modules on the fly, as needed, or you can set the kernel to do it. It has been over FOUR YEARS since my last and only Linux crash, and it was my own C++ code goof that caused that. Except for overhead lightening storms I don't take my server-firewall down. It doesn't crash, phantom reboot, hang, barf, leak memory, race, or do any of the other things my W2K workstation does. And when the occasional app crashes (because I do a lot of beta testing) it is automatically cleared from memory without crashing the kernel.
>
>Mine is not a blanket statement though that there is no full blown Linux applications (not browser based). There are possible apps out there but just a tiny portion of the pie. Browser based, yes, but as one of us is saying here, there are a lot of issues yet: printing, print-out legality, etc.
>
>You are really behind the times here. In about every class of application there are as many or more offerings available in Linux than there are in Windows. As time goes on, and Microsoft continues to eat its young, there will be fewer and fewer non-niche programs available on the WinXX platform.
>
>Printing issues were related to WinPrinters, but that never has never been an issue at all. If you don't try to install WinPrinters you won't have problems. However, I hear that a couple of WinPrinters have been reversed engineered and now work on Linux. But, stay with Cannon, Lexmark, HP, Brothers, Oki, -did I miss any?- that are not brain dead Win-driven (GDI) and you won't have problems.
>
>What browser based apps were you talking about?

I am referring to business applications - not tools - i.e. Manufacturing System, Hotel System, Accounting System, etc. The interface can be browser based or Windows, or Linux.