Ah, but this assumes online job listings at third-party job sites are significant indicators for this segment. They may be, I don't know, but it's not something that's obvious either way. It also assumes that the number of jobs in other segments is not down, something I don't know, and I bet you don't know either. We'd have to research that.

Are the numbers of jobs offered on *this* site down? If it's down (amd I'm not saying it's not) is it down significantly from 1Q/2000 which can be called the max bubble point for the industry? Moreover is it down relative to the software development industry as a whole? If so, how much?

I don't see it.

Point being is the truth of the matter is a lot deeper than doing a simple search in one source like Dice and Monster, and then applying classic linear thinking to draw conclusions.

I know this: if I'm a VFP person developer, and I have a good project to staff, Dice.com and Monster.com are last resorts. I've been a part of dozens of projects over the past few years, big and small, and virtually all people thereon are there as a result of referrals, or from recruiters who may themselves then scour Dice.com and Monster.com. I don't know. I know this: If people need to come from Dice or Monster, we're assumed in bad shape until proved otherwise. We're bottom feeding at that point.

I get calls from fox people and recruiters staffing serious projects all the time. The frequency and quality of these offerings does not seem to be down. But I'm just one data point, so that's just anectdotal evidence

Now will .NET jobs greatly outnumber VFP jobs? Absolutely. If you get work from Dice and Monster that's something to think about. If, on the other hand, you get your work because you have a good name as a result of a track record of delivering good value, then that's much less of an issue.

So in closing, if you get work from Dice and Monster maybe VFP isn't the best vehicle. The best vehicle on Dice and Monster at the moment is clearly Java. It may become .NET, and we could make sensible bets on that, but not for a while.

I see no evidence that things are down for VFP compared to industry average. Moreover, the situation outside the USA, Germany aside, seems positively buoyant.

**--** Steve


>Steve,
>
>I have to strongly disagree with you on this one. I know that you like to pay attention to detail, but while JVP's numbers might not be exact they point a trend which can not be ignored.
>
>I can attest to the fact that I have watched VFP numbers go down thru the years. As I stated previously, there are some geographic areas where you will get 0 hits on VFP. At other times, VFP will show up as a "Plus" skill. I've seen one ad in the last several months where .Net was a "Plus" skill for a VFP job. Quite a few .Net or VB ads where VFP was the "Plus" skill. There is no way to spin that number.
>
>I would expect that you will see .Net numbers go up while VFP will slightly decrease.
>
>PF
>
>
>
>>Fabricator! Nice research there, John.
>>
>>I did the same search for .NET in PA on Dice.COM. You are correct: 33 hits. Including jobs whose only reference to .NET are the characters "NET" which includes words like
>>

Netegrity
>>

Intranet
>>

Net access
>>

GSM network
>>

Etc. Etc.
>>
>>The vast majority of those 33 hits aren't .NET at all. Most of those are ".NET would be a plus" category and it's VS 6 work.
>>
>>In other words, you didn't check your results before publishing them. Clearly on Dice .NET matches "network" and "Internet" and a slew of things that have nothing to do with .NET. So it's not 33, it's less than 10.
>>
>>Are you always this sloppy with everything you post here? Apparently so.
>>
>>FWIW, "Object Oriented" gets 22 hits in PA on Dice.COM. "Object Oriented AND .NET" (with Advanced -> boolean parsing selected, which appears to give more correct results) is 3 hits in PA on Dice.
>>
>>Also FWIW, a seach of C# in PA on Dice.com comes up with 79 jobs!!!!!. Yet only one of the first 30 hits I briefly scanned is clearly for C#. The rest are all for C and C++. Therefore it appears the "#" character isn't significant on Dice.com, just like the "." in ".NET" doesn't appear to be significant either.
>>
>>Keep it real.
>>
>>**--** Steve
>>
>>
>>
>>>>
>>>I peruse places like Dice.com everyonce in a while to see what dotnet skills people are looking for.
>>>>
>>>
>>>Across all regions...
>>>
>>>59 hits for FoxPro
>>>1074 hits for VB
>>>637 hits for .NET
>>>
>>>In PA (my state):
>>>
>>>1 hit for FoxPro
>>>51 hits for VB
>>>33 hits for .NET
>>>
>>>Enough Said... Of course, it is probably me scaring all the FoxPro jobs away...< s >...
>>>
>>>On Monster.COM
>>>
>>>Accross all regions
>>>
>>>145 hits for Fox
>>>469 hits for .NET
>>>1237 hits for VB
>>>
>>>In PA/Philly area
>>>
>>>6 hits for FoxPro
>>>6 hits for .NET
>>>27 hits for VB
>>>
>>>
>>>The tell tale sign is looking at the job descriptions. The jobs for Fox for most required skills in other areas besides fox.
>>>
>>>Granted, this is not the sole source... but I believe it reflects the relevant overall trend...