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Seven women and children shot dead at checkpoint
Message
De
02/04/2003 16:07:46
 
Information générale
Forum:
Politics
Catégorie:
Articles
Divers
Thread ID:
00772318
Message ID:
00773248
Vues:
14
Tom,

That's a huge burst of words!

>Can you truly say that you trust any news source over another?

If there is an engagement or commitment of some source with the "facts", I do. Things like "US media under fire" (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/2904073.stm) makes me wonder (Peter Arnett, Phil Smucker, Geraldo Rivera).

>I am amazed at your comments about how the United States has influenced Brazil.

You are not remembering that I posted in another message that I, as a 15 years old boy, lived the revolution that took place in Brazil (my father was a military at that time, remember? You even called me of...?). Latter in the university (beginning in 1998) I participated in events that took place at that time and on, and could learn about the influence of the US in those happennings. I didn't read about that elsewhere. In the last few years there was heated discussions in the brazilian Congress about those, so called years of led", torture, murdering and US participation.

>Now that “Brazil” is in control and the United States is no longer in the picture, everything must be perfect.

No, we are a country plenty of poor people, social injustice and owing money to everybody in the world, but we are trying to find our way, trying to build a democracy with justice. It's a long way, but think we've started.

>We are indeed an evil people trying to control the world.

You are saying that. I never said that. If you find a single line where I said that, please would you point me it? I ever say americans are great people that I learned to admire and respect. I strongly say that about the US government. The Plan for the New American Century (PNAC) and those folks that made it really think about taking control of the world. Or not?

>By the way, United States citizens do not know anything about our government or the world. We just wait for people on Internet Forums to tell us about reality.

You're an intelligent person and think you didn't mean to say that. I've NEVER tried to offend your inteligence.

>Why question the knowledge of a member of the forum that happens to be from the United States? You seem to have too much passion on this topic and you are now questioning peoples knowledge as well as what they say and believe.

I didn't question the knowledge of any member, but I found some irony in the sentence ("I’m sure if the gov’t in Brazil starts killing and torturing people, you’ll want us to leave you alone too.") written by Paul, and the reply I made weighted in the same amount of the blood that came to my head. If I made a wrong evaluation of Paul's sentence, I sincerelly apologize.

>You are dismissing the thoughts, feelings and knowledge of those of us who live in the United States. We are evil! Have you not stated this enough? What do you hope to accomplish with your words, constant references and now belittling United States citizens?

As you can read in my previous lines (what I say about the american people, that I respect and admire) I must understand that you are changing US government by american citizens. So you must be outraged with your government, no with me.

>I personally think that you have gone too far in expressing your feelings towards the United States, its citizens, the way we think, what we think and how we are as a people. The constant attacks are getting tiring and personal. You may not think so but I do! Do you hope to change the world with this approach to enlightenment? Yours seems to be a one-man effort to condemn the United States for everything we have ever done and truth be damned! If it is bad it must have been due to the United States.

You're right, maybe I've gone too far, I must agree with you. But if I've gone too far it's because your government has gone too far! There is nothing personal in that, but you're taking it personally.

About my constant attacks, most of them are plain references ipsis literis of what can be found in the news. It hurts you? It bothers you? Sorry, it hurts me too, it bothers me too!

Of course I can't change the world, and even have that intention. Should I shut my mouth? Can't I say what I think is wrong? You're happy with what's going on? If you have a better proposition of what can be done against world's brutality, please tell me and I'll join you. Don't have? I'll stay with mine.

Tom, I'm NOT CONDEMNING the US! Think you will be, also, long term victims, as others are short term victims of your policy. Are you satisfied with your internal situation (economy, level of employment, inflation, social security...)?

>If I were from another planet and had been viewing your posts for the last few days I would have a very strange picture of the world.

That, probably, would be the perception many people have (not seeing my posts, but seeing the real world), and they don't have to come from other planets.

>I may not like war (any war) but I have little to say about such events. Yes, the United States is still a world power and very visible to everyone with a television set. Nobody likes us because we lie, take over all nations of the world and kill everyone who gets in our way.

The american people have a different behavior from other countries' people. You assume the burden of your governants. When you say "Nobody likes us because we lie..." I'm sure you are not a liar. You and all our fellows here are decent people, no doubt, and deserve all my admiration and respect. I'm 100% sure about that! If I didn't believe in what I'm saying, I swear to God I wouldn't be in here.

>By the way I do have advanced degrees in Political Science and History so I think I have read a few books on the world and its people and governments.

You already told me that. That's why it's an honor to me having you reading AND replying to my posts. Thanks, Tom, it makes me very honored and happy!

>We know that we are not perfect but it sure is getting old hearing you tell us “all about ourselves and our history”!

Nobody in this world is perfect, and is not my intent to teach you what YOU can teach me. We just see things in different ways. I'm not saying that you or me owns the truth, that's why we are discussing but, just by getting angry with people like me, you are forced to bring your better arguments to discussion to dismiss mine, and there should come the light.

Just a question: people here in UT would feel happier if I stoped my "war related" posts? Maybe we can ask Michel to set up a poll about that. :)

Tom, don't hate me, all this is not about anger or hate, is about trying to build a better world, for ALL of us, and you can believe me, I'm being sincere.

For the last time: I don't hate the american people, I admire and respect the american people. What I don't have is ANY respect or admiration for those guys rulling the world from Washington DC, with the honourable exception of Gen Powell, that we all in Brazil find a decent a respectable man, and I think if he was in the presidency of the US, we (the world) would be in a much better situation.

With all my respect, consideration and friendship,

Fernando
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