Hi Tamar,

>Even if I weren't a beta tester or MVP, I'd still use the bug reporting link because then I'd know that my report was going to the Fox team.

I think this discussion up here is not about whether or not send it to microsofts buglist, but rather posting it here on the UT.

>>Personally I find this a sad situation. the VFPT does not produce a (complete) list of confirmed and unconfirmed bugs. If everyone was to post their bug findings here on the UT then EVERYONE could at least be notified of the bug. This might reduce the chance that people tracking the same bugs over and over again. Also, since the UT is interactive other people could jump in and provide additional information or possible workarrounds.

>That depends on what the goal of reporting the bug is. My goal is to have it fixed. The best way to do that is to report it to the team.

I agree that it makes a slight difference whether we are talking about beta's (NDA/Non-NDA) of products or released products. People should not release products developed with beta's. But in general I disagree with your standpoint.

I'd rather post the bug publically (e.g. on the UT), discuss it on the UT, find workarrounds and later post it to MS. Though it of course is important that the bug is fixed, we all know that once a products is released it might take up to a year or even longer before the bug is fixed. Meanwhile developers encounter the same bug again and again, try hard to isolate the problem, try to find know references to the bug, find workarrounds and if that all does not solve the problem, post the problem on the UT. Which might or might not be spotted by someone who knows the bug. Most of the time I don't have time to wait for an answer. I need to resolve the problem ASAP, because clients are waiting.

Your solution of letting people posting problems and waiting for someone who knows the solution to their problem is ineffective. If you'd posted the bug on the UT at forehand then people can search, research and effectively solve and avoid bugs caused by VFP.

And *if* there was a mechnism where the VFPT could flag the bug as beeing confirmed, then at least we ALL know what the status is of that bug.

We've discussed the matter of the black hole, where bugreports go in and there is no feedback. Some have disagreed that it is a black hole because they've gotten feedback from the VFPT. Well very nice, but too me it still is a black hole, because I've got no idea what bugreports have been submitted by other members and a absolutely no clue about the status and severeness of those bugs. It might not be a total black hole, but at the least it is a very dark grey hole.

>FWIW, most of my bug reports come during betas when public posting is irrevelant.

It still could be valuable to post them publically (When not under NDA), as developers might still encouter those bugs in the final release if they could not be fixed within time.

I realize that many of us are so used to and comfortable with the "black-hole" principle, they cannot see that there is an opportunity to a huge improvement in reporting, solving and workarround bugs.

Walter,