You guys got it all wrong - the broadest implementation of the VFP paradigm is the VFP frame-work. I think you would agree!

The most restrictive implementation of the paradigm is the form wizard. A framework fits somewhere between the broad VFP (only) framework and the narrow form wizard framework.

VFP has thousands of syntax features and myriads (on orders of magnitude) of oppertunities to implement the syntax.

In the bowels of VFP, certain kinds of solutions (or workarounds), OCX to OCX communications - for example) can only be implemented with - for lack of a term - low level VFP scripting.

With framworks you write code to meet the requirements of the frameworks paradigm. The framework interviews you, and you provide the values.

A framework is a conceptual model for building SW. A GUI, branded as "Frame work" is (lets be honest) a form wizard.

Lets put it to the test. We still have the unbeaten "RIO Challenge" for DOT NOT. I would be interested in seeing if a Framework could immulate RIO. I would also be interested in how big the EXE is. Are you interested - or - is the sun in your eyes?:-)

In my book - only a woosie would rely on a GUI FW to build a VFP application. The only thing good about a Framework may be the logic the developer can employ to force a very narrowly scoped interface on the user (code for lowering user expectations:

"dear user ...its a technical impossibility - the GUI behavior you wanted cannot be delivered ... you will have to accept drilling down 5 modal forms to get that piece of the data".

And the claim they are more productive than VFP in the hands of experienced developers is belied by the fact that framework shops are usually bloated and can takes years to complete a project.

So - how about it - a RIO framework challenge - remember it has to be as fast and crisp as RIO (exactly like it) and [totally] built with your framework of choice.

Ladies and gentlemen - at this stage of your careers, shouldn't you be shunning the form wizards?:-)

Of course - I understand - some of you are "house" developers and have to use what gets the pay check. Most of my work are new design / new code projects - so most of the decisions are left to me. Don't be woosies - make me eat my hat - take the RIO frame work challenge!