>I don't really want to change direction onto a discussion of Catholic Liturgy ;-) but again this illustrates the tendency towards demonization that surrounds such issues. IMHO we all need to question all aspects of the issues, even those that seem to support our own case.

Right. We really need not concern ourselves with minutiae of any religion's rituals - they are they private matters, for members only.

It's when they want to discuss medicine and proscribe stuff for non-members, when I'm getting deurinated.