John,

Looks like you may have duplicated your post.

>Doug
>
>it is not the disagreeing that gets to those on the other side of this thread, but the tone in your writing. instead of saying something like 'you guys get on and do that and i will do this, and perhaps together we can accomplish more', you tell us we are in a panic expending emotional energy that could be far better spent if we did it your way, or just shut up, trust ms and let them rule the roost. we are all (apart from ms) supposed to be on the same side here, so as far as i am concerned, why don't we support each other as in the quotes above and get on with life? as i see it, there is no one solution to this problem, so the aim of this thread should be mutual support and the seeking of more and more ways we can try to persuade ms, or even just make ms aware that inexpensive 'marketing' instead of a couple of cheap ads to the chior is needed.

Well, let me explain a little and maybe that will help you understand why I have written things the way I have at times.

I don't know how long you've been "hanging out" but it looks like, from your account, that it's been since May 17, 200 - about one year. I've been here since July 9, 1999 and before that active in the thread system over on Compu$erve. Actually, I was one of the official archivists on the FoxPro CIS form for a couple years. IOW it was my job to capture, read and track all messages for archiving purposes. That's been since around 1991 - so around 10 years or so.

For almost that whole time there have been esentially two 'camps' of people; those who have constantly proclaimed that "FoxPro is dead" and those who have attempted to respond. Well, after almost 17 years of marriage I have discovered that you cannot use logic against emotion. Just doesn't work. <g>

The question in my mind is this: Where is FoxPro today? Well, those who fall in the one camp will immediately respond, "That doesn't help tomorrow", to which I'd reply, "You are absolutely correct" But I would hasten to add that neither can they and at the end of the day. There is absolutely nothing that anyone can do to change the future. Except, other than two things that I can see (if you see others I'd like to know what you think they are). These two things are:

1) Spend some time preparing.
2) Do your best with the product you know today.

It is certainly responsible to get prepared (based on your best judgement) and I have always encouraged this. And, there's nothing wrong with using your powers of persuasion as Mike is wanting to do to. Still, at the end of the day it seems to me that each individual is responsible for themselves.

But the facts are that VFP is still here, right? Yes, and it is being moved into the future with the current release and from what I know will be even better in the future (VFP8). I say that not knowing the behind-the-scenes information but from personal knowledge of the character of those in whose trust FoxPro currently rests. I know these people and I can assure you they know the community.

So.. What is one to think about the folks who, after numerous responses attempting to explain some of the facts continue to insist that everyone take a position that is simply not based upon the historical facts to think? I have come to the conclusion that a very few simply are in some sort of ewmotional state that prevents them from accepting the facts and as such it strikes me that the only way to 'reach' them is emotionally. Or just ignore them since they really aren't acting IMO in a rational manner. As I said before, if they believe that the end of FoxPro is nigh then the rational response is to do something and that's why I have decided when this happens to simply ask them what they personally are doing about the 'crisis' they see. If they have no response or, as some have done on this thread, make personal remarks as some have done to me then I will respond accordingly. I'm not without fault. Never have been, never will be - BUT, if you go back and carefully reread some of the messages in this thread I'd dare say that I have not been the first to make personal remarks. Well, other than kidding round to try and lighten things up a bit. <g>

I would like to read your messages to those on the 'other side' asking them the same types of questions you have asked me. I think they are very reasonable questions - but if you only pick one side you can be thought to have a bias and that will lessen your moral authority.

All I am asking those who are concerned enough to so state here is to demonstrate their evidence and their proposed solution. I am inder no obligation to agree and I reserve that right. I am perfectly comfortable that others take a different take. I would just like to get past the unproductive stuff.

perhaps I'm more optimistic than I should be. Perhaps some simply cannot get past their worry to get to where they do something..


>
>i do recall that in the early part of the last centuary, women weren't allowed to vote. if they kept their mouths shut and just towed the line and believed blindly that the powers that be were aware of their desires, do you folks that are averse to vociferously drawing attention to the VFP situation believe that they would be voting today? sure as hell NO! they would still be packin' lunch for pappy to go stand in line to screw up his punchcard (not to mention the fun he could have impregnating his chad!). i am sure there are a couple of other such examples that could be used. perhaps the civil rights issues, freedom of choice, gay rights, etc, etc,... no?

Well, you're certainly correct that things have changed in this country as a result of folks speaking up. That in no way means that any of these changes are either good or bad by virtue of their existence. There are quite a number of people who think that 'freedom of choice' is a euphimism for murder and 'gay rights' one for the forced imposition of moral degredation. Without arguing the merits of each the existence of each of these simply is.

So the same with the curent state of FoxPro. It is what it is. How folks choose to respond is their business. I have stated what I plan to do in response a few times and if others wish to go another way I'm ok with that.

But I do get a little tired of the whining. <g> The 'tone of my writing' is only in response to those who seem to be unable to accept that others have a different take. For example, before I responded to Michael the way I did I thought that he had insinuated that my taking my position somehow was causing his position damage and there was IMO a definite attempt to coerce me into taking his POV. *shrug* I see that as an attempt to lay a 'trip' on me and I'm just not going to respond the way he seems to wish to keep him happy. IMO he's just going to have to 'get over it', as I said. I don't mean that in any other way that a) I acknowledge he 'feels' the way he does, b) I don't, c) I'm not responsible for the management of his emotional state, d) I respectully disagree and e) I wish him well. I don't mean that in a mean or vindictive way - just that I'm not responsible for another's emotional state. If he's upset I guess he'll just have to learn how to deal with his emotions. THey're not mine...

That's really all..

Does that help?