--No Turkish keyboard installed!!! Tsssk, tssk. I didn't either:) Don't worry Turkish VFP users are accustomed to me writing all the time using only English char set. But just be carefull when you're writing something like "I'm bored" in Turkish:) There are still kids that'd interpret it as it's written

LOL ! One of the first things Cem taught me was to always say "I'm ill" if I wasn't feeling well when speaking English in earshot of a Turkish speaker.

Of course seeing you in Izmir would be a very high priority. It was very interesting to meet you at Devcon. I'm afraid my Turkish was pretty bad at the time. I had just returned from Spain, I think, and I remember using some Spanish and Catalan words when trying to speak Turkish.

--Appears on TV next to none but big cheese is still a big cheese

I don't think I realized what a big deal he was until two or three years ago when I read in Newsweek or someplace that when Paul Wolfwitz visited Turkey he stayed in the guest house in the compound of Cem's kosk near Kandilli.

--Charles your Turkish is perfect I can say. I wonder how my English looks from
there:)

Frankly, I am always amazed at how fluently you write in English. We both know how very different the grammer is between our two languages. Going back and fourth between English, French, Italian and Spanish is almost a word-substution game and if you are fast enough you can almost think in one language while speaking in the other. But with English-Turkish I find I must think in Turkish for the word order to be even a little bit correct.

You write English with native-speaker idiomatic ease. I am sure if you had the opportunity to live here for a year you would speak it the same way. ( you should call Markus about going to Texas for a while ;-)

--PS: I still tell my friends here about how much I was surprised when you called me Cetin (with correct Turkish) and talked to me in Turkish during Devcon:)

I had a lot of fun on my last trip. I always wear a sport jacket when I go out in public when I am abroad and my wife dresses NY upper east-side, so in Istanbul they weren't sure what to make of us. We don't look like typical American tourists and since I have a beard and am pretty obviously not Hacibaba most seemed to conclude I was a rich Istanbulu and Denise was my Russian girlfriend. I have two Levantine friends who spent time with us who really do look like gangsters ( close - they are in the tobacco business ) or bodyguards and their Turkish is what you would expect from people whose families have lived in Turkey for almost 600 years. ( one claims to be decended from the Genoese who built the Galata Tower. ) We were generally treated very well and were certainly not hassled by anyone.

( should be mentioned here for lurkers: Turkey is not only one of the most fascinating places in the world but no people will every make Americans feel more safe, welcome and comfortable than the Turks. This is a proud, Western oriented society which is the model for a democracy with Islamic roots and a huge success-story in the advancement of women's rights and entrepenurism. Terrific place for a vacation and a very nice climate to do business )


>>I haven't yet seen those turtle nests either (shame on me, people from all parts of the world come just to see that and I still haven't visited there despite living close). Maybe we go together. Haven't seen black sea region yet too but I'm afraid to go there. I might never want to return back:)
>>Cetin


It is a plan then. When I come to Turkey, you and Metin and I will go paint Foxes on the sea turtle shells in Antalya and then go visit the Las in Trabzon.

guzlerinden operim, kardesim


Oh - before I forget - I wanted to ask you and Metin :

There is an expression is Turkish I always loved which meant

"I am a gentleman and you are a gentleman - so who will milk the goats ?"

Sen aga ben de agasi kim koyun something or other.

Do you know it?



>>>O zaman ben de Turkce yaziyorum :)) .(sende Turkce klavye olmadigi icin ben de kullanmiyorum. Bu arada sizin dilin en sevdigim yani sen-siz ayriminin olmamasi. Bu cok sikinti verici birsey emin ol) .
>>
>>Reading Turkish again is a challenge. I read the second sentence as " In the meantime, your language is my favorite as you do not have to separate the 'sen-siz'. This is really a 'pain in the neck' ( Inglizce deyimi )
>>
>>Does 'sen-siz' mean the familiar and formal as in 'istersen' vs 'istersiniz' ?
>>
>>Yes, but English has a lot of strange things. It is much easier to spell Turkish words. ( one of the big reasons I have that picture of Ataturk on my wall :-) and also a reason Turks seem to be far ahead of Arabs and Iranians in computer technology. ( the advantage of an alphabet that can be easily rendered on a keyboard with common ASCII sets. )
>>
>>
>>>
>>>> ( my room mate in college was Cem Kozlu and we continue to be close friends )
>>>Cem Kozlu gercekten cok onemli biri.
>>
>>I call him a 'buyuk peynir' ( another English idiom ) He's also a very nice guy. His English is better than mine. Robert Kolleji ( oh, sorry, Boazci Universitesi ) Denison and then Stanford. ( and his wife is a yabanci - but you would be amazed at her Turkish - and she now speaks English with a Turkish accent ) When we were in college Cem won creative writing competitions. His son Bulent just graduated from Harvard. Gercekten cok akilli bir aile.
>>
>>>
>>>Istanbul is one of my favorite places in the world and Turkish food is, of course, the best in the world. ( I wish I could have dinner tonight at Korfez or just Hacibaba or someplace in the Cicek Pasaji. I remember the OLD Galata Koprusu - the one that burned - and many nights I in the fish restaurants that hung out over the water ... )
>>>Bunu duyduguma sevindim. Genelde yabancilar bizim yemekleri sevmez. Siz genelde Cin yemeklerini cok seviyorsunuz. Ama ben Cin yemeklerinin kokusuna bile dayanamiyorum.
>>>
>>
>>I really like Chinese food - at least I do in Hong Kong, Bangkok and Singapore. But Turkish food ( which Americans most often think of as Greek, Lebanese, Morrocan, Israeli filan filan ) is really my favorite. When I lived in Izmir, I remember there were a lot of American military at NATO headquarters who would buy fruit and vegetables from the American commissary that had been imported and never understood the tomatoes and oranges in the local market were better than anything they could get at home.
>>
>>I still prefer American beef, but I can take pretty much any American to a simple kepabci when they have sut kuzu and he will be very impressed. My wife knew nothing about Turkey before we went and now she can't stop talking about how wonderful everything was - especially the people and the food.
>>
>>There were two doner kepab places I particularly liked on Ataturk Cad in Ankara ( I think they were called Bursa and Iskendar )
>>
>>But of course the best thing was sitting out on the waterfront with good friends, drinking raki and eating meze for hours and hours before the fish was served...
>>
>>
>>>>On my last visit ( 1999 ) I was impressed with the very nice blend of the old and modern in Istanbul and Izmir ( but of course I didn't recognize Izmir and I miss the dolmuslar. ) ( sorry, still using the yabanci
>>>Dolmuslarin nesini ozluyorsun. Ben nefret ediyorum. Istanbul'da hala fazlasiyla var.
>>>
>>
>>:-) I thought they were fun. ( of course I was very young and crazy ) I am not surprised you hate them. Most of my Istanbulu friends did. But in Ankara and Izmir they were a lot faster and even less crowded than the bus.
>>
>>>Eger tekrar Turkiye'ye gelmeye niyetlenirsen haber ver. Hicbir turizm acentasinin soylemeyecegi yerleri soylerim. Onlar genelde parayi dusunurler ve bakir yerlerden bahsetmezler. Mesela gecen sene Antalya-Cirali'ya gittim. Kaplumbaga yuvalari olan sessiz harika ve cok ucuz bir yer.
>>
>>I will definitely let you know when I am coming back to Turkey. I would love to see Istanbul through the eyes of a fellow Fox-head. Turkey is such a wonderful place to find peaceful beaches and quiet places outside the cities. I remember Antalya. The last sentence : I got "a wonderfully quiet and inexpensive place" but what is the part about Turtle nests? (Turtle shells? kabugu ?